The Doll Podcast
All the latest news and views from the world of dolls.
The Doll Podcast
Masterpiece Collector Karin Schmelcher
When a doll collection comes up for auction, we glimpse not just beautiful objects, but a collector's passion, vision, and journey. The upcoming Masterpiece sale at Ladenburger Spielzugauktion in Ladenburg Germany on April 4-5, 2025 presents just such an opportunity with German collector Karin Schmelcher's extraordinary collection of rare French and German dolls.
Join host Louisa Maxwell as we explore the highlights of this remarkable collection with Pia Fast Seidel of Ladenburger Auction House and distinguished collector Marco Bröning, Karin Schmelcher’s longtime friend. They guide us through exceptional pieces including two rare Bru Jeune ballerina dolls with wooden bodies that can strike an elegant pose. An Andrè Thuillier (AT) doll with mesmerising blue eyes that "speak to your heart," and the historically significant Emile Jumeau Bébé awarded the prestigious Medal d'Or at the 1878 World Exhibition in Paris.
What distinguishes Schmelcher's collection is her unwavering commitment to originality—every doll retains its complete original costume and accessories. Her expertise led her to co-author definitive books on Bru and Heubach dolls, making her both a collector and historian.
Karin Schmelcher’s collection is truly a Masterpiece weaving a rich tale of the art of doll making, the role of the collector and the doll historian. Join us for this fascinating conversation about passion, provenance, and the enduring legacy of one collector's vision.
Welcome to the Doll Podcast. I'm your host, louisa Maxwell. Every collector knows that your collection is a passion, a unique vision that says something about you. When a collection of dolls comes up for sale at auction, we get to share in that collector's journey and we learn not only about the dolls but what drove the person to acquire them. It's that story, the unique journey that the doll carries with it from person to person, that makes collecting such a fascinating way to explore social history.
Speaker 2:So this brings us to the story of German collector Karin Schmelcher, who started collecting in the 1980s, seeking out the best in French and German dolls. These dolls inspired her to write and contribute to books on Brou and Heuberg dolls, and she built enduring friendships in the doll community around the world. Now Karen has decided that it is time for her dolls to move on to new homes. Like many collectors, karen has entrusted her legacy to an auction house that will share her vision. Her dolls will be auctioned in a masterpiece auction on April 4th and 5th 2025 in Germany at the Ladenburg Spielzug auction. Guests are Pia Zadel of the Ladenburg Auction House and distinguished collector Marco Brun, a lifelong friend of Karen Schmelke. Pia and Marco welcome to the Doll Podcast.
Speaker 1:Oh hello.
Speaker 3:Thank you so much for inviting us for the podcast. I'm so happy to be here. Well, Luisa, it's a great pleasure joining your podcast. Thank you so much happy to be here.
Speaker 2:Luisa, it's a great pleasure joining your podcast. Thank you so much, Pia. Since 1989, Ladenburg Auction House has been bringing fine dolls, bears and toys direct from European collections to an international market. Mrs Schmelke was a discerning collector who sought out pieces with their original costumes and accessories. Can you tell us about some of the rare dolls that will be in this masterpiece sale?
Speaker 1:Well, in the next masterpiece sale we will have two really great dolls which are really important to me and I'm pretty sure those dolls were also very important to Karin Schmelcher. One of these dolls is the Brü, size 9. This is a Brü model with a really rare wooden body. This doll is like a ballerina. It was so great to make the pictures of those two dolls because you can put it in such a great position, and it is great because we don't have only the first number nine. We also have a little ballerina sister, a little Brumodell doll also, which is really, really great. She comes with blue eyes. The big one has brown eyes and she's a little bit smaller and she looks just gorgeous in her beautiful dress. The pictures of them in the catalog are just fantastic. So I'm pretty sure those two dolls are one of the biggest highlights in the auction.
Speaker 2:They are incredible dolls. I have seen them. You've sent me the pictures and, listeners, we're going to have so many pictures. In fact, you can go right now to dollpodcastcom and you can see them right now. We'll have them in sequence so that you can follow them as we speak. And then, of course, we're going to give lots of links to the Masterpiece Auction, because the photography is beautiful and, if I may say, is beautiful, and, if I may say, the tiny ankle joint, the delicacy of this beautiful ballerina, is so just absolutely sublime. Marco, what do you think of the ballerina?
Speaker 3:Well, they are amazing dolls and they are so unique, especially the large one. I have seen only one other doll in this size and also the other smaller one. They are just extraordinary, with splendid eyes and just awesome.
Speaker 2:Marco, you have known Karen Schmelker since the 1980s and you have been there when she has acquired some of the fabulous pieces in her collection. As collectors, we all know the thrill of the chase and the incredible rush when that perfect doll is in sight. What was that special something that made Karen have to have a doll?
Speaker 3:Well, as a collector. It's the moment, it's the hunting, and then it's everything about presence. This was extremely and is extremely important for Karin. Extremely important for Karin, and every single detail, such as originality, closes from head to shoe. Each detail she was interested in and I guess this is what we are able to see now at Ladenburg's auction the charm of this tremendous work. She did and spent time for these kind of dolls. It's a true work of art, her collection.
Speaker 2:Was this something that was very, very important to her, Marco, that she found things that were completely in original condition.
Speaker 3:Yes, the originality was very important to her to while combine the presence of a doll and not just having a rare doll. It must be everything, and we can see it in these outstanding auctions Now. It's really a great one-of-a-kind quality.
Speaker 2:That's what we were all searching for, because it is just so amazing when we find a doll that speaks as it originally spoke, from the hands of the doll maker to us today. It's an incredible journey through history, isn't it, pia? And you are handling every day these amazing pieces of history, whether it's a stife bear or these fantastic dolls from Karen's collection. What doll do you really love from her besides the ballerina which we mentioned? But what doll speaks to you historically from this group of dolls which you've been working with and photographing, getting them ready for the sale in April?
Speaker 1:Each doll was so amazing. So I'm the person who makes the descriptions and the pictures, make the descriptions and the pictures. So I can say that the AT doll was, of course, one of my favorite dolls. She got those blue eyes which are just touching your heart. They're so great and so emotional. To make the pictures of the AT was really easy because she's a gorgeous doll and maybe the first one in this condition that we ever sell in the in the auction. So, of course, this is one big highlight that will maybe shocked us, for the price could be. We never know what happened.
Speaker 2:Well, you see, this is the thrill of the chase. So this is an andre to lear doll, how tall is she?
Speaker 1:She's about.
Speaker 3:About 22 inches, I think so 22, 23 inches, it's a number 10.
Speaker 2:Yes, and what is she wearing?
Speaker 1:A blue, beautiful, I guess, original dress and she has the perfect underwear to this and the fitting shoes and of course, the hat to this and the fitting shoes so, and of course the hat. In whole, the doll is an absolutely great item, an absolutely highlight for every collection.
Speaker 3:I need to agree, pia. It's an outstanding AT from a collector's point of view. With these splendid blue eyes and, as you say, these original blue dress, it's just the perfect match. And this is Karin, this is all about Karin. It's the perfect match of the presence of the eyes and the clothes. So this is well, it's just a lovely AT, and I'm extremely sure that all collectors around the globe will be interested into this amazing doll.
Speaker 1:Yes, the thing was I remember when I came into her room with the dolls there was one special room where she had all her great french dolls. So I remember when I came in, this at popped out for I don't know, all the dolls are beautiful, but this AT popped off because she got the look with those deep blue eyes and that was the first doll. When I saw her I said to her that has to be in the auction as a highlight. So I'm so happy and glad that we got this doll in this next auction.
Speaker 2:And I think this is the magical moment for all people who love dolls or for all people who collect anything. There are just certain objects, that you see them and that's it. You're in love, basically.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, I'm totally in love with the AT. I'm pretty sure that a lot of people will fall in love also with her.
Speaker 2:A lovely story that I heard about Karen's collection is that her first piece and you know, your first piece as a collector is something that you always remember, and I believe that it was her husband that bought her her first doll. Is this true?
Speaker 1:Absolutely, that's true. I remember that she told me it was the first present from her husband. Actually it was a young love. They just come together. She met her husband right after the school and he bought her those German Handwerk doll. It was, from the collector's side, an easy doll. It was not the highest quality, but it was the first step for collecting dolls. So she found out with her doll and Her husband created on that moment the start of a fabulous collection.
Speaker 2:You see, that's it. It's the inspiration. Marco, did she keep that doll with her?
Speaker 3:Well, as far as I know, she started with this dolly face doll, as every collector basically, and as we all know, she adapted very quickly and learned so fast. I know she adapted very quickly and learned so fast and yeah, well, you need to change your collection. And she also upgraded her collection and today we see the Crème de la Crème of her collection being auctioned at Ladenburg. So, as far as I know, the handwork is not around anymore no-transcript.
Speaker 1:Yes. Well, I guess Karin has the feeling for really high quality dolls. We have to say and think about this time was not like right now. You don't have the Internet and a clear understanding what really high collecting means. So she was really really fast that she collected extremely high prices dolls, because she started with a simple doll and then she at next she was already such in touch with this whole collector community that she bought. I guess the next doll was already a Simon Halbig, but a really really rare one. So you know she made big steps.
Speaker 2:Well, I have to say Simon Halbig are my favorite dolls, especially their fashion dolls. They're my true passion as a collector, even though I love French dolls. So I don't want my jumeaus to be jealous, marco, did Karen travel to acquire these dolls? Because, as Pia said, a very important point is that the internet hasn't been around that long, and when I first started collecting myself in the early 90s, you'd be finding things in antique shops and at auctions. Auction catalogues were the main place and it's very interesting to hear how Karen had to go and investigate. So where did she find her dolls? Did she travel?
Speaker 3:Yeah, it was a totally different time and there was no internet around. So the good thing at that time was that basically every weekend there was a kind of flea market or doll show, also in Europe and Germany, and so this was also the time when we met at a doll show here in Germany and she was traveling, like myself. We met in December 1989 in Paris at this famous Flea market and to see a very rare, famous collection which came on the market. So she was traveling a lot and I guess this is all about doll collecting, it's connecting people and this is what I like and what Karin also liked a lot. And while she trained her eye and she was able to find the look, the presence of a doll and educate it and this was a time when she wrote the book of Heubach and Brue and it's all about this there was no internet, so she was traveling, she trained her eyes and she got all this knowledge. Fabulous time.
Speaker 2:I mean, it is a fabulous time and I still collect and read books on dolls exhaustively. But people do rely on the internet for information today, so it's a different world. And also auction catalogues, pia, your catalogues. They're a very important source of information because you photograph, you classify, you look at the provenance, the history and each doll has a unique story. So it must be very interesting to put together this catalog right now with so many rare dolls.
Speaker 1:Yes, it is. It is a pleasure for us to be able to get this collection and create a beautiful catalog for this, and I guess it is always nice to have, like you said, a book at home, because of course, we have in the Internet. On our website you will find an archive.
Speaker 1:So, that means you will find dolls that we sold in the last 20 years with the prices, with the descriptions, with starting prices and the end prices. So you can see and that's very interesting, the price difference about 20 years. So of course this is a great thing to have the Internet, but otherwise, to have catalogs at home is always a good, you know, it is always a good remember. I'm pretty sure that Karin Schmelter is very happy to have a catalog with her treasures, to look every night before she goes to sleep inside the catalogue and see her treasures again, and I'm pretty sure that is something what everybody would love to see that the collection is not only sold, it is a masterpiece also in the catalogue because you can see it every day if you have the feeling for that.
Speaker 2:It's wonderful because it's one collector's vision and that is unique and she shares it with us, and then auction houses share that with us too, and it's one as you said to have. And I have a stack of catalogs from my years of collecting and my favorite one's actually my first Simon and Hal Big Fashion doll. I still have that catalog from many years ago and these things are a part of your history as a collector and they're a part of the history of the collection.
Speaker 1:And you know what it is really work from my heart, because it was not only that. I do that because of the great of course. It's a phenomenal collection and I'm pretty sure that is one of the best options that I ever, that we ever do. But Mrs Schmelcher, or Karin, was really a friend of mine. I know her a long time. When I have some questions I called her and sometimes she was helping me out with some questions about some brooms. I do it really for her.
Speaker 1:Yes, I remember that we're picking her up the whole day, my husband and me, and bring her to our auction house to show her all the dolls that she already gave us for the first part, and we were talking just the whole day for every doll and it really takes so many hours. But it was a pleasure for me because I learned so much from her.
Speaker 3:It's all about her passion, I guess.
Speaker 2:Yes yes, so of course Karen included her dolls in many books and she worked with other authors on the books. Can you tell me a bit more about the books and what they were about?
Speaker 1:I know was the co-worker and she was working with her together for this really, really nice book, and the great thing is that one of our highlights my personally highlight the big ballerina is inside the book. So I remember when I was always looking for some information in this brew book. I always fall in love with this ballerina and I'm so happy to have her in the auction. I have to say that again. Yes, but you can see this ballerina in the brew book.
Speaker 2:Isn't it wonderful when you have the book and the doll and the history and the story? Marco, have you used Karen's books as a source when you're studying your collections?
Speaker 3:Sure, certainly, and I had a long debate with her during the late 80s, also about this Brühl book, because she documented, for instance, that the numbers are just not directly linked to the size of a Brue, and this was totally unique at that time. So, yes, it's still today a kind of master book to learn about Brue Heubach, and they are just fabulous.
Speaker 2:So one of Karen's most prized pieces is a doll by Emile Jumot that was awarded the prestigious medal d'or at the 1878 World Exhibition in Paris. Can you tell us a little bit about this Jumeau bébé, because this wonderful doll is going to be in the auction and we're all going to be able to see her.
Speaker 3:Oh, louisa, one of my favorite dolls and, I guess, the most sought after dolls in the world. Well, yeah, it's a gold medal. It's the first BB Emilio Mou introduced while taking over from his father, pierre, and remember it was the Industrial Revolution. We are coming from the fashion dolls to a totally new doll, which is the so-called BB today, and with a totally different proportion. It's a childlike proportion with a new face and this face is just outstanding with these large almond eyes, today called web around eyes, with a mouth closed but still somehow open as this doll might speak to us. And an extra costly feature is this eye eyeshadow. And it's a totally new face and outstanding presence. And, yeah, I'm extremely sure that this doll will be create interest for a lot of collectors. And the extraordinary thing is that Karin Schmeicher just not had this rarest size number five with brown eyes, but also the next smallest or largest size number four with splendid blue eyes. And they are extremely dramatic dolls and with an outstanding presence to highlight.
Speaker 2:How beautiful, what a wonderful story. These dolls are bringing this great moment in history to us today. Do you think, Pia, that museums will be? You know, it's such a high quality doll with such a distinguished provenance, Do you think even museums will be chasing some of the pieces in the auction?
Speaker 1:Oh, I'm pretty sure that some of the great doll museums or also toy museums want to have this doll with such great provenience as a highlight. I mean, this is a part of history, a big part of history, and I'm pretty sure that that will be interesting for a museum. But we also have some great collectors which have amazing collections in the background. So I'm pretty sure that also some private museums or private collectors will want to have this doll.
Speaker 3:Unfortunately, Pia, I need to agree. Knowing quite some European collectors with this provenance, I'm sure that the European collectors group will be interested in this doll with everyone.
Speaker 2:But then the other wonderful thing is some of these great collectors from around the world are also happy to share rare dolls like this one and have them featured in exhibitions. So we share through the books, we share through the internet, we share through the catalogs and then perhaps we even get to see them live in an exhibition. And this is a piece of history. It's also a piece of fine art and a really beautiful object, absolutely so, pia, it's going to be a very exciting auction and you are in a beautiful part of Germany, the Ladenburg Auction House.
Speaker 2:It's a family business in your home city of Ladenburg, germany, and it's a medieval town with great charm and half-timbered houses and winding streets. I mean, it just looks so beautiful. And then there's proximity to Heidelberg and Mannheim. It's a unique destination holiday for any collector who wants to bid. I know if I was going to bid on one of these amazing dolls I would have to be in the room. So if any collectors do wish to come and you know the auction is not until April, so there's time to book your seats on the airplane, folks If any collectors do wish to come to this historic auction, what does your city offer to them?
Speaker 1:Well, I think the most beautiful thing is in Ladenburg. It's small. I mean for Americans, everything. All the cities are pretty big and you need a car for everything, but here in Ladenburg everything is petite, Everything is like you go on with your feet. So our auction houses, of course, with the, the auction, the big highlight for the day, but our auction house here in the middle of a beautiful park area. That means if you need a break you can go outside and you have the beautiful park in front of you, Also the river. We have really, really great little restaurants which are just maybe two minutes to walk far from here. Also, the hotels are pretty close, so I mean it is like a really safe bubble here in Landenburg.
Speaker 1:So, of course, as you said, we have Heidelberg and Mannheim, which is absolutely great. In Heidelberg you have the big castle on the hills, which are absolutely amazing to see. There are many things what you can do over here. Right next to our auction house, we have a little castle, also a beautiful castle, which is our town museum, and Ladenburg is built from the Romans usually, so that's pretty interesting. Also the Americans they love it over here because when the Americans say the town or the house is old. Then the Germans or the Europeans say, well, yes, it's old, but you have to see Ladenburg or you have to see other cities over here. So yes, we have beautiful artifacts from the Romans two minutes away from here. So yeah, it is really interesting, it is absolutely safe and it's a meeting point for our collectors, for our customers, because they're not coming only to the auction, they're coming to their little pretty holiday in Ladenburg also to have a meet and greet after the auction in the restaurant.
Speaker 2:It really sounds idyllic and I think that if we are going to travel for a great historic moment like this in doll collecting, to just drink in the culture and the history, what an amazing experience.
Speaker 3:And it's so nice to travel to this beautiful place. It's so close by Frankfurt, so it's easy to travel to Frankfurt to fly in or by train, and then it's just half an hour. For me, it's always so nice to be there and to walk through this beautiful city.
Speaker 2:This is great. It's a short flight for me then too. How far away are you from Frankfurt Airport?
Speaker 1:That's about 45 minutes, so that's absolutely close to Frankfurt and it's right on the Autobahn, so you don't have to drive inside too many cities. It is directly on the Autobahn, so you will find it really shortly. And maybe, what is also very interesting for all those collectors from America or from other countries, we want to invite all the collectors to invite them to our Benissage on the 4th of April, because on the 5th of April there is only our auction and on the 4th we want to make a beautiful meet and greet, together with wine, with good food, with maybe a little pianist to make a little bit music, for us to invite all the customers to see that we have, of course, a beautiful auction, but also we have a beautiful city around us.
Speaker 2:That's wonderful. You're going to share your culture, your food, your music. I'm starting to get really tempted. And Frankfurt is so close, I mean from any destination in Europe. And Frankfurt is so close, I mean from any destination in Europe, it's a really easy flight. So I think we're all going to have to think about being a little bit less on the internet and maybe more live and in person. But of course, if someone wants to bid on the internet, they can, can't they? You do all your auctions live on the internet.
Speaker 1:Yes, of course, the whole auction is seen on YouTube. Shown on YouTube. You will see my husband, my father and me as the auctioneer, so you can see the whole auction at the internet. You can bid online and, of course, we have employees which are speaking fluent English, so even if somebody wants to have a line for the auction, this is not a problem. We would call everybody in English, in French or in Italian.
Speaker 2:That's perfect. So it's going to be a wonderful international audience and it's going to be a real event. Marco, you have known Karen Schmelke and her collection all your life. How has she inspired you? I mean, we've talked about the wonderful dolls, but as we come to a close here, I'd like to leave it over to Karen. How has she inspired you as a collector?
Speaker 3:To me it's about the passion and the energy she had. It was first of all the hunt and then the presence, so I learned somehow from her to get an eye to see the difference. So somehow she trained me and I will be always grateful to her for that kind of experience, which was just a unique time, and I'm always thankful for this.
Speaker 2:I think that's the great thing we can all give each other as collectors and as auctioneers and as experts, and all the various things that bring the doll community together. Pia, what is the link to your website? Can you give us your website address, because they're just going to have to see this ballerina all these amazing dolls. What is the link to your website? Can you give us your website address, because they're just going to have to see this ballerina all these amazing dolls. What is the link to your website?
Speaker 1:So the website is wwwspielzeugaktionde. On that website you will find our online catalog. In this catalog you will find a description in English and in German and, of course, a lot of extra pictures from each doll. Also, if you want to order the print catalog, we will send it to you.
Speaker 2:You also have a YouTube channel, which we'll give links to, where you actually talk about the dolls at length and you show the dolls in three dimensions. We get to see them and it's a very lovely way not only to learn if you want to bid, but to learn about these incredible dolls. So we'll be giving links to that on the website as well. I think it's going to be an extraordinary event and I'm so delighted that we got to all meet together and to talk about Karen Schmelker's legacy. It's an auction that's going to draw an international audience. Do you, marco and Pia? Do you feel that this is going to be even another way for the international doll community to come together and celebrate Karen's legacy?
Speaker 3:Well, to me it's the place to be. The online version definitely is helpful, but during this time where we have, at least in Europe, only very limited fairs, it's the opportunity to meet and greet and to see these kind of once in a lifetime highlight dolls. I guess it's a perfect opportunity to also get friends, Know each other and somehow it will be interesting Suddenly you are having no friends anymore while the auction is going to start because suddenly you are a competitor. But to me it's a perfect opportunity now to see all these kind of highlight dolls. They are not showing up very often.
Speaker 2:Pia, when you're acting as the auctioneer, you're able to see the entire audience in front of you and you must see friends competing for the same doll, as Marco said, and that must be quite a lot of drama. And yet you have to keep the whole room moving and keep them bidding and also deal with online phones. I mean, it's a very fast-paced environment, isn't it?
Speaker 1:Yes, it is and I could tell you stories. They are so funny because, well, when you fall in love with something I saw in the options, sometimes so much drama and so many funny stories. I mean, I remember one time that friends sitting next together and they just, you know, they try to not show that the friend is bidding against the friend. So, yes, that sometimes happens, but that is what auction is doing to the collector.
Speaker 2:I think you just have to have it. It's passion, it's also commitment and it's your dream. But what I love about what you're planning with this event is, as you said, there's going to be the meet and greet the night before. People are going to share culture and music and beautiful food and they're going to come together as a community. So I hope on the day of the auction they are kind to each other and give each other a chance. I know in one auction I very much wanted a wonderful doll and somebody did give me a break and she said, okay, well, if you go for that one, I'll go for this one. And we did it, and we did it. We both got the dolls we wanted. So sometimes it can work out and I think that the friendship in the community sometimes we hold each other together and other times, well, only one person can- win.
Speaker 1:Only one person can win, that's true. I mean, at this point I have to say, sometimes the people feel much more comfortable when they are on the phone because nobody sees them. It happens sometimes that customers go out of the room and, well, they get a phone line from the auction, so that can also happen. Sometimes we see that most of the Europeans like to be more in the background, you know. So yeah, that's, I'm pretty sure, is the reason why many people are always or like to be on the phone.
Speaker 2:There's so many different auction styles and I do feel if you're really passionate about it, try and be in the room, but if you can't be, the phone or the internet are there to help us achieve our doll dreams. Marco, is there anything in this auction? We don't want to betray your secrets, but have you seen something in the catalog you think you'll bid on?
Speaker 3:Well, as a European, I tend to be not so public, so to say no, no, we don't want to know. I do not want to challenge my competitors now.
Speaker 2:Don't challenge them, but just tell me. Are there a few things that have caught your eye?
Speaker 3:Yes, yes, I have some emotional topics with some dolls there and I'm extremely sure that there's something for everybody, not just the high class, high value dolls, also some, let's say more well in brackets, normal dolls, but with an also extraordinary presence. And that's so nice about this special collection that every collector can get something from Karin and honor this special person.
Speaker 2:I can't wait to read the entire catalog. I'll be pouring over it and I think it's going to be a wonderful event. So thank you both of you, Pia Fassadel and Marco Bruning, for joining us on the Doll Podcast.
Speaker 3:Thank you so much, Luisa.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much, Luisa.
Speaker 2:Thank you for joining us on the Doll Podcast. Thank you so much, luisa. Thank you so much, luisa. Thank you for joining us on the Doll Podcast. To find out more about this episode, just go to our website, wwwdollpodcastcom, where you'll find lots of photos and links and more information. You can also find the Doll Podcast on Facebook and Instagram. Be sure to subscribe to our podcast to keep up to date with all the latest news. The Doll Podcast is created by Niche Podcast Productions. Our music is by Celtic Conspiracy. Copyright Louisa Maxwell 2025. All rights reserved.